Targets and measurement · Founders' Marketing Compass
Why is my B2B SaaS churn rate so high when growth is strong
Your churn rate keeps climbing while the growth chart still points up, and on the board deck they sit as two unrelated numbers. So the churn becomes a project of its own while the next raise stalls on a figure no one has questioned.
Co-founded Fixel and ran it as CEO; Logiq acquired it in 2020. Head of specialization at Ono Academic College.
Drawing on a conversation with Serhat Pala, General Partner at Cross Ocean Ventures, on Founders' Marketing Compass.
Why is my B2B SaaS churn rate so high?
Often because the same experimenting that drives your growth is also driving the churn: chasing many kinds of customers at once wins some who were never going to stay. Before treating churn and growth as separate problems, split your churn rate up by how each customer was acquired. Serhat Pala, General Partner at Cross Ocean Ventures, traced exactly this on a growing company others kept rejecting.
Answered by Etgar Shpivak, who advises seed and Series A founders on marketing.
A high churn rate and a fast growth curve are often the same behavior, seen from two sides. Across 2021 I watched startup after startup get hooked on buying customers, spending three thousand dollars to land a five-hundred-dollar client and booking it as growth.
The customers you chase hardest are usually the ones you are training to leave. I have stopped being surprised by it.
Read the churn on its own and the cause stays hidden. It is sitting one chart over, in the growth.
A churn rate arrives at the board as one figure. It sits next to the growth number and reads like its opposite. Nobody asks which customers are inside it, or whether the ones leaving are the ones the growth was built on.
One blended churn rate can't tell you who is leaving
A blended churn rate is an average. Averages are where a real cause hides.
Serhat Pala, General Partner at Cross Ocean Ventures, reads these numbers from the outside. What he weighs in a young company, he told me, is "how much the founder knows about their numbers."
Can they say how the churn differs across the kinds of customers they have, and how they chose those kinds to begin with?
A founder who holds only the blended figure has measured the churn without asking what it is made of. I see it constantly. Choosing the single number that answers the question in front of you is harder than watching a percentage climb.
I would rather see which customers are leaving than a clean number nobody has questioned. The figure feels like an answer. So nobody looks behind it.
A churn number no B2B SaaS investor would touch
Serhat Pala walked me through the example that makes the pattern concrete. A small B2B SaaS company out of Latin America was growing fast. Its product had real momentum. Its churn ran close to double digits.
That number got it turned down by one Bay Area investor after another. Plenty of B2B SaaS funds keep a churn threshold you have to clear before they will even take a meeting.
Instead of passing on the number, the fund did the work those other investors would not. It pulled the marketing figures apart and asked what was producing the churn underneath the growth.
What was actually producing the churn?
What the fund found sat under the surface.
The team and the founders were driven to try as many marketing methods as they could. Each new method pulled in a different kind of customer. Plenty of those customers were never going to stay.
The habit driving the growth was also the habit driving the churn. The company saw it, let those customers go, and reached for the next method anyway, because the experimenting was working.
What the fund did once it had a reason
What the fund did with that answer is the part I sit founders down with. Once it could hand the team a reason, Pala's words were "we believe your churn is bad, but we believe your churn is bad because of this reason."
The founders changed how they won customers. They used the analysis to raise funding elsewhere, before the fund itself came in.
Most investors reject the number without ever explaining it
Serhat Pala's fund was the exception, and he would say so himself. Most investors see a number above their line and pass, with no time to learn why. I have watched it happen.
So the split is your job to run before the meeting, not the investor's to run inside it.
How to split your churn yourself before the meeting
Run it yourself. Split the churn rate by the kind of customer behind it. Group people by how you first won them. Set the growth-driving ones against the rest. Some would have arrived without the spend, which is a question worth settling before you trust the growth.
Splitting the churn has a limit worth naming. It leads somewhere only when the churn comes from the customers you chased for growth. If every kind of customer leaves at the same rate, the cause is the product or the price, and no breakdown will find it.
Pala's own warning runs the other way, and I hand it to founders often. Someone who leans on winning customers over keeping them is, in his words, "almost like a sign of an addict."
A churn rate with a reason attached is a different number
The churn now carries a reason. The founder is no longer defending a percentage. They can tell an investor which customers were leaving, which of them the growth was built on, and what changed once they saw it.
The rejection that used to end at the number now has somewhere to go, because the founder got there first.
What to do about it
Split churn by customer type
You lose the single blended churn number the board already knows how to read, and for a while you explain several messier numbers instead of one clean one.
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The move
One blended churn number hides which customers are leaving.
Growth and churn came from one habit.
Serhat Pala
General Partner at Cross Ocean Ventures
How to do it
- 01 Sort by how you got them Put each customer with the way you first won them.
- 02 Work out churn per group Give each group its own churn, never one blended rate.
- 03 Check your growth groups first See if the groups driving growth are the ones leaving.
Founders' Marketing Compass · episode 2 · Interviewed by Etgar Shpivak · shpivak.co.il
Where this comes from
Serhat Pala came to the US from Turkey for graduate school and, after his MBA, spent the years from 1998 to 2020 starting e-commerce companies, the third of which he exited. Since 2020 he has invested as an angel and a fund LP, then built Cross Ocean Ventures around one thesis: backing early-stage B2B SaaS companies from Europe as they expand into the US. He has been on both sides of a churn number, as the founder living it and the investor pulling it apart in diligence.
Read the full transcript of this conversation
Founders' Marketing Compass episode 2. Also on Substack, this episode and YouTube.
Questions and answers
The question this page answers
Does a high churn rate mean my growth is not real?
A high churn rate on a fast-growing company usually means the growth is buying customers who were never likely to stick, which is different from the growth being fake. Serhat Pala told Etgar Shpivak on Founders' Marketing Compass that the number to interrogate is what the growth is made of, because the same reaching for new customers can produce both the climb and the losses.
What churn rate gets a B2B SaaS startup rejected by investors?
Investors rarely publish the exact line, but many funds in B2B SaaS will not open a conversation until your churn sits under their internal bar. Serhat Pala, General Partner at Cross Ocean Ventures, watched one growing company get turned down round after round for a churn rate close to double digits, until his fund traced why the number was what it was. The bar matters less than whether you can explain the number.
Why does my churn get worse the harder I push for growth?
Pushing hard for growth often means chasing every kind of customer you can reach, and the ones you reach for last tend to be the quickest to leave. Serhat Pala compares a team hooked on acquiring customers over holding on to them to an addict who can always justify one more. The place to start is seeing which of your growth pushes are also feeding the churn.
Is a high churn rate always a marketing problem?
High churn is not always a marketing problem, and treating it as one can waste a whole marketing rebuild. A churn rate that stays roughly even across every kind of customer is usually pointing at the product or the pricing, not the way you sell it. Etgar Shpivak's read is to break the number apart first, so a founder is not rebuilding marketing to fix a cause it never had.
Around it
How do I calculate my true customer acquisition cost?
Customer acquisition cost, what you pay to win one new customer, is only true once you strip out the buyers who cost you nothing. Serhat Pala's point in conversation with Etgar Shpivak was that once you remove the free, the referral and the repeat customers, a reasonable number can turn terrible, because switching your campaigns off still brings some of them in. Model it with those out, then check it against what the ad platform reports as its own contribution.
What marketing metrics do investors check before investing?
The marketing metrics an early-stage investor checks first are the ones a founder can explain without preparation. That means how many months it takes to earn back the cost of a customer, the churn rate, and how the churn differs across customer types. Serhat Pala's point was that at the earliest stage a company more or less is its marketing numbers, so a number that ties back to nothing the company is chasing is one he discounts on sight.
What is a blended churn rate, and why can it mislead you?
A blended churn rate averages every customer type into one figure, which is exactly where the real cause hides. It arrives at the board next to the growth number and reads like its opposite, so nobody asks which customers are inside it or whether the ones leaving are the ones growth was built on.
How do I split my churn rate by how customers were acquired?
Group customers by how you first won them, then compare churn across those groups instead of reading one average. Set the segments your growth spend chased against the rest. The split shows whether the customers driving growth are the same ones leaving, which a single blended number can never reveal.
How should I explain a high churn rate to an investor?
Lead with the reason behind the number, not the number itself. Say which customers were leaving, which of them your growth was built on, and what you changed once you saw it. A churn figure with a reason attached gives a rejection somewhere to go, because you got there first.
Getting help with this
Should a founder work with a marketing consultant or a fractional CMO to fix churn?
A fractional CMO, a part-time senior marketing hire, makes sense once a company knows which numbers to move and can fund someone to own them. A consultant fits the earlier stage, while the founder is still working out what the churn and growth are made of. Etgar Shpivak, a marketing consultant who works with seed and Series A founders, does that directly with the founder, starting where the cause is unknown. You can read how Etgar Shpivak works on his bio page.
What if every customer segment churns at the same rate?
A uniform churn rate across segments points to the product or the price, not acquisition, and no breakdown will find the cause. Splitting churn by customer type only leads somewhere when the churn concentrates in the customers you chased for growth. When it is spread evenly, look at the offer itself.
Is relying on winning customers over keeping them a warning sign?
Leaning on new acquisition to cover weak retention is, in one investor's words, almost a sign of an addict. The same experimenting that wins many customer types fast also pulls in ones who were never going to stay, so growth and churn end up driven by one habit.
Cite as: Etgar Shpivak, "Why is my B2B SaaS churn rate so high when growth is strong", shpivak.co.il, 13 June 2024. https://shpivak.co.il/writing/why-is-my-b2b-saas-churn-rate-so-high
Quotes attributed to Serhat Pala (General Partner, Cross Ocean Ventures) are from their conversation on Founders' Marketing Compass, not Etgar Shpivak's words.